If the Obama administration thinks they are helping the economy they need to look at this link:
http://cnnmoneytalkback.blogs.cnnmoney.cnn.com/2009/06/16/mortgage_modification/
I just talked to a person in our Congressmans office who even said that this loan modification was only to sugar coat the public to think they were going to get help…What a joke, Banks, Government, Car industries get bailed out and who is still paying? You guessed it the TAXPAYERS… Its time to tell our government how things should be done and the people need to come together and rebel!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It’s simple: You can’t spend your way out of debt. The Chinese already own a large portion of our country and now Obama has made it worse. We have destroyed out manufacturing base and outsourced most of our service industry. The jobs that are left in the US are being increasingly done by immigrants with H1-B visas that are willing to do high tech jobs at blue collar wages.
This article should be called “The Audacity of a Government that thinks they can create wealth out of thin air and not bury the country doing it”. But that might make some liberal big spender mad and we can’t have that now can we…
1-20-09 The beginning of a NEW error!
There is no way around it. The economy has grown worse for as long as anyone can remember. During every slowdown, we have slapped on another band-aid and moved on. This time we are nearly bled out. The private sector wants someone else to pay for a transfusion to profit the shareholders immediately. The government wants to hide the illness from the voters with another ever stronger pain pill. We are at continuous morphine this time and unless we address the under lying sickness, it will be time to call in hospice and quietly put us out of our misery. We are past the point of “let the free market work” or “let the government balance out our needs”. We need to realize where we are and determine where we want to be. It is time to put outdated ideological propaganda behind us. This is not the time to stand rigidly with any political party. Trusting any institution to act in a way other than their own self interest is folly. The TARP funds were large enough to start an entirely new banking system but instead it was soaked up in the morass of past mistakes. We have to cut out the cancers in government and in our financial institutions or our legacy to our children will be catastrophic. Do we have the guts to stop fighting for our immediate self-interest and look at the interests of our children? Until we can, no plan will ever cure our problems.
Well, here we are! Everyone was soooo infatuated with this Obama fella. Now I am enjoying watching him backtrack on all the promises he made. I have a very high mortgage payment but little other debt. So far I have made all my payments and kept the bills paid too. I don’t make a lot of money but I’m getting by. Things like going out to lunch and heating my house have been given up. What thebama is talking about for a single guy like me is about $15 a week less in taxes. Thanks but I make more than that playing in a band for an hour. WTF?? Can’t the almighty bama come up with something better than that? How about giving everyone who isn’t forclosing on purpose a break? Make the baks and lenders reduce EVERYONE”S payments. Thay are the ones who should be sucking it up! This goes to show that no matter who you blindly vote for you’re still voting for a thieving conniving, lying, politician. People are stupid. That’s why no one noticed that as soon as the magic kenyan got into office the rhetoric changed from ‘bailout’ to ’stimulus’. They’re both a pile of doo doo in my book. I followed all the rules and those who were irresponsible are getting a ’stimulus’ read BAILOUT. Not a bit fair, I say. Well, you know best America. Thanks a lot you Dummies!
I have one simple question: When will those of us educated and responsible citizens that have made all of our mortgage payments on time receive some incentives or rewards for our good behavior? Why do we continue to give money to those that were irresponsible in the first place? Shouldn’t we be rewarding good behavior and responsibility? We always seem to rescue the struggling instead of rewarding those that excel. As a teacher, I feel we do this a lot in our schools. This has always been preplexing to me and would like some input.
I have a question about loan modification. My mortgage company is Homeq (a company that is impossible to work with). I lost my job in February of 2008 and asked Homeq for a payment plan so I could keep my house. They got a Judicial foreclosure order in order to foreclose on my home. In September of 2008 I used part of my retirement benefit to pay Homeq $14,000 in back payments and asked for a loan modification in order to avoid foreclosure and stay in my home. Again they gave me a forbearance repayment plan that I could not afford. I was forced to either sign the forbearance plan they drew up or my house would be sold at auction on September 2008.
Now my home is scheduled to be auctioned again on the 25 of February 2009 at 1:30 unless I pay outrageous payments offered by Homeq. The only way I can save my home is to come up with $6,000 as a down payment on a loan modification. When I asked why I had to pay a down payment, I was told the state of Virginia requires a down payment for loan modification. Is this true?
I filed bankruptcy in 2007 to pay back payments and avoid garnishment by a credit card company. The attorney I used had me paying less than the required mortgage payments which caused me to get further behind on my payments and I have been going downhill every since
DO YOU THINK BANKS ARE GOING TO REFINANCE PEOPLES LOANS THAT REALLY NEED THE HELP. IF YOU’RE NOT KEEPING YOUR PAYMENTS UP YOUR CREDIT NOT GOING TO BE GOOD ENOUGH TO QUALIFY. IF YOU DON’T HAVE A JOB OR IF YOUR HOURS ARE CUT BACK AND YOU’RE NOT MAKING ENOUGH MONEY. I THINK BANKS,LOAN COMPANIES RITHER IT BE A HOME, CAR, CREDIT CARD OR A PERSONAL LOAN THEY SHOULD BE MADE TO AUTOMATICALLY LOWER EVERYONES INTEREST RATES. AND ALSO THE ELECTRIC COMPANIES ALSO SHOULD BE MADE TO LOWER THERE RATES ALSO NO ONES LIGHT BILL SHOULD RUN NO $500.00 A MONTH FOR A AVERAGE SIZE HOME. THEY SHOULD BE MADE TO REFUND THE PEOPLES MONEY THAT THEY HAVE BEEN RIPPING OFF. HOW CAN PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING ON FIXED INCOMES, OR PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING FROM WEEK TO WEEK PAYCHECKS. WHO CAN AFFORD TO EAT AND BUY MEDICINES OR CLOTHES FOR THEIR KIDS. YOU MAKE A CHOICE PAY MY LIGHTBILL OR MY MEDICINE.EVERYONE IS HURTING FROM THIS ECONOMY THE SMALL SELFEMPLOYED BUSINESS MAN TO THE BIG BUSINESS MAN. THIS STIMULUS PACKAGE SHOULD BE HELPING EVERYONE. NOT JUST THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE MANAGE TO HOLD ON TO THEIR HOMES,CARS OR CREDIT CARDS. NOT THE PEOPLE THAT STILL HAVE THEIR HOMES AND IT’S NOW NOT WORTH WHATS OWED ON IT AT LEAST THEY HAVE A ROOF OVER THEIR HEAD. THE HOUSING MARKET WILL COME BACK. SO HELP THE PEOPLE THAT ARE MONTHS OR DAYS OF LOSING THEIR HOMES AND CARS.
“”"” Eventually “”" define eventually you jerk !!! again are your eyes open to the world around you ??? The people can’t digest eventually….they need the word “”" NOW “”" the people need help “”"NOW”"”
To Jim in Cincinnati
I am no great Obama fan, but I think you are missing his point. When He advocates change he may mean “change the way things get done” a little, but his primary goal is to “change what gets done.” The social spending you complain about is aimed at getting the kinds of things done that President Obama likes (remember he did not write the bill, congress did).
Secondly, a major part of the governments legitimate role is to protect society from catastophies that unchecked capitalism (or manipulated markets impersonating capitalism) creates. It seems to me that the people who most ardently propose capitalism as the cure for everything are the same people who manipulate markets in ways that run directly opposite to the principles of capitalism.
Giving tax rebates to first time homebuyers will push many who are underwater over the edge and persuade them to walk. This will depress prices even further and reward those who scrimped and saved by enabling them to pay cash.
As for rescuing the economy, the FED did that five years ago and look what happened. You ain’t seen nothing yet.
Absolutely not, the stimulus bill and how it was rushed, not read and typically not thought out other than the pork via rail for Reed and the Pelosi payback for votes is an outrage. I am so disappointted that President Obama is allowing himself to be used by these terrible and greed Senators and others
Karen,
As a business owner I can tell you that (at least for most decent owners I know), there is nothing that makes us happier than creating jobs, helping with medical insurance, and being surrounded by happy, loyal employees.
But unfortunately, the government and most states–especially ours, NY–make it difficult or impossible for growing businesses to hire and help people in your position. And now the banks are adding to the problem. From Tax burdens to strangling credit, many businesses can’t afford to keep the people they have, let alone hire more. We have managed to stay healthy, no layoffs and even continue to give raises every year (most business owners I know are not). But it gets harder and harder.
The health of the economy starts with the health of business, and especially small to mid-size business. That is where the innovation and potential job growth is (the vast majority of jobs in this country are created by small business, not by Ford and GM). So (and this is nothing new, though many don’t believe in it), stimulating business is the catalyst to creating jobs, creating income, which turns into spending, which kick starts the whole economic cycle.
Hopefully our new government will take this to heart and realize where America’s bread is buttered.
All the best to you in your own job search.
I just got laid off this month (FEB). How can I spend any money when I don’t know how long I can pay mortgage? PLEASE what we need are JOBS. I can’t stress this enough. Those Unqualified people for mortgages would be qualified if there were enough high paying JOBS.
1. If there’s one thing I’ve learned, no one knows *anything*. There are plenty of smart people, but they are wrong as often as right. When history proves them right, they are labeled “prescient” or “geniuses.” when wrong, they’re fools and idiots. The reality is that none of us has ever experienced something like this before, no living person can get his/her arms around the complexity of it, and for sure no one can make specific predictions. Depression from 1015 to 2018? Perhaps, but probably not. Think of all of the “crazy” predictions of the last century that have and have not come true. We simply don’t know, best intentions, brilliance, education and research notwithstanding.
2. Putting aside the banking and wall street insanity, most even-headed and informed people know that this boils down to the micro level of people–and often companies as a result–living beyond their means. You can link so much of the mess to that. Who doesn’t know a family who lives in a home they can’t afford by any normal financial measurements? Who doesn’t know someone driving a car they shouldn’t be, or remodeling a home using borrowed money equal to or greater than the real value of the home because a bank said they could? And so on.
We absolutely should not let crooks and swindlers and insanely compensated executives who wreck companies off the hook. But at the same time, we should not lose sight of the classic “personal responsibility” argument that has been long lost in favor of immediate gratification. We can throw blame everywhere. But almost everyone has played a part in this meltdown, whether big or small, knowingly or not. Our country lost its way and ignored the values that built it, and this is just one big giant chicken coming home to roost.
The stimulus delayed the second great depression. Notice I say “Delayed.” Now that we spent our protection money to save worthless banks, we won’t have anything to stem the next crisis which will be demographical-a mass exodus of retirees from the financial markets combined with whatever five-year tantrum comes from the economy. The sheer lack of buyers in the next crisis (due to falling entry-level incomes) will create a multi-year depression beginning about 2015 and perhaps ending in 2018. So make sure you watch the trading ranges when we enter recovery-sell near 14,000 next time! This is a secular BEAR market, any real recovery will be a head fake until at least 2018.
The plan set in motion by Reagan is complete, we are a tax free and a broke third world country, where the rich don’t pay taxes, and the poor fend for themselves, any questions?
I sure hope the stimulus pckage works. I keep remembering the 2and than some trillion of tax cuts for the Wealthy that the last administration did. It was supposed to turn our economy into the Land of Milk and Honey.What really happened to that story?? By the way the expnses for the war are another trillion, on top of that tax cut.
Suddenly everyone starts complaining, what were you guys doing that last eight years when this country was being systematically demolished?
You guys are funny.
Last week, the ranters were all about how the stimulus had too much stuff in it that would pay out over an extended period, and now you rant that the stimulus doesn’t have enough long-range, high-yield investment in it.
Obama’s looking back at you, waiting for you to catch up. The stimulus was conceived as a balance of short-term stimulation and high-yield investments, and you guys are just beginning to reason out why it should be that way. Unemployment is a short-term measure, green energy is a long-term investment. If you want to end up with a balance of short-term help and long-term returns, you’re starting to catch on.
Stimulus is not a panacea, but to the extent that the investment portions of the plan yield good returns, those investments set an example by which others can profit. This, too, is part of the plan.
Anticipate failure if you like, but from here it looks as if Obama’s smart, has his head on straight, and is taking action while the buffoon class takes shots at him while struggling to figure him out.
Keep trying, maybe a little smart will rub off on you.
All I have to say is that Mike P. from Fort Worth Texas, who’s comments on Feb 15, are spot on…this guy knows what he’s talking about…Finally some sane, rational thought. God Bless you Mike P. If only your were the President.
First of all, I’d like to say: The Stimulus SWINDLED US!!! Talk about a worthless plan, it was a HUGE transfer of wealth (theft) from Taxpayer to Corporation! With the government as an accomplice!
The government is doing exactly the opposite of what they need to do. Let’s say they’re my personal investor, I want my money in strong companies or solid assets. They go off and invest in weak, failing companies, and toxic assets! Are they purposely trying to make me broke? I mean, what is their end goal, to create industries of weak government supported companies that crowd out the strong independent companies? Is it part of an intentional plan to break and Nationalize all companies?
I (won’t) get $400, but I will get a share of Trillions of debt that I have to pay off. Nice deal!
And Californias’ answer to the crisis? An anti-stimulus plan! Raise taxes and fees and de-invest in education.
Geitner does not know what he’s doing, he was on watch over the NY Fed as the collapse began. Why was he picked as Treasury Secretary? And the chair of the economic advisory team? Government does not create jobs, it creates work (a burden), is she on drugs?
Here are some links:
UK on Obama:
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/iain_martin/blog/2009/02/12/barack_obama_is_screwing_up_on_the_economy_be_very_afraid
EU on coming March crash:
http://www.europe2020.org/spip.php?article576&lang=en
Jim Rogers on Geitner:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTQ4zVWt1wQ
Gerard Calente on Collapse:
The US has allowed 40 years of decay and cancerous neglect to erode our national infrastructure and our ability to lead.
From Nixon to Reagan to the Bushs we have let the fantasy of something for nothing and the fiction that the wealthiest 1% of Americans need ever more byzantine ways to avoid taxes become the overriding and only concern of our federal government.
We have abandoned education, skills, knowledge and a shared vision of working together for an “every man for himself” Lord of the Flies mentality.
Fear, Greed, Hate and Ignorance have become the four horsemen of the Republican Apocalypse. While the Democrats fear responding to even the most vile and heinous of Republican Lies for fear of offending a drug addled, multi-millionare talk-radio junkie.
In short, it is going to be a very long road back if we can even make it back. We have placed our entire social infrastructure on a trajectory for oblivion and it is going to be very hard to pull out of this death spiral.
We are going to need to invest in our children, our shared resources. We need to receate a society where people have the opportunity to take risks, where one misstep does not have the potential to destroy a person’s life.
This is going to be difficult, and the Republican party has demonstrated that it is business as usual for them. Tax cuts for the rich and no services for the rest.
According to the Republican party, government can never work. Very well, let’s get them out of the business of government and put them in the private sector where they belong.
No one who believes that government is always the problem, belongs in government.
It will be a hard road back, but Americans don’t shy away from hard work if we know that everyone will share in the both the effort and the reward. It is time for change.
The only thing it might do is soften the landing on this recession, but at what cost?
We don’t need “stimulus”, we need “stability”, and that will come when we get the economy back to a -reasonable- level. Running an economy around people spending more than they make is foolish, and it needs to get back to a maintainable level.
The problem now is that the government is spending so much money, it will take years to dig out of that level of debt – and nobody who’s in office making these decisions will EVER have to pay for them – and that SUCKS!!!
Here are some basic immediate things that need to be done YESTERDAY!:
1. The new SEC chief needs to immediately repeal the Mark To Market accounting rule that was implemented in 2006. Ever since then, banks have undervalued their entire loan portfolios because of this rule, causing a massive drop in real prices. Japan implemented this in the early 1990s and it caused a decade long price drop.
All you need to do is look at Simon Property Group and General Growth to see how their companies have been slammed by this one accounting rule.
2. People need to get behind infrastructure spending to generate long term job growth and economic prosperity.
When normal every day citizens attend regional transportation meeting and can’t understand why local governments should subsidize rail project – all they need to do is look at the Northeast Cooridor and understand that these projects take 10-20 years to fill up to capacity. Take I-635 in Dallas – in 1980, it was laughing stock. 8 lanes wide – “Who would ever use that freeway?” – Now it is a top 10 most traveled highway.
Rail is the real way to get people from point a to point b. Subways, Commuter Rail, and local trolley/light rail. Building more roads is not the answer.
3. Most people think banks are the only place to raise money for new business. The Government needs to re-educate society on the many avenues of funding small enterprises such as SCOR registrations or S-1 filings with the SEC. Not enough people know these avenues exist to try and raise capital and instead rely on their banker to buy into their idea.
4. Stop believing everything you see and hear on TV. These reporters and TV news networks are filled with people with Radio-TV degrees – not Economic or Finance degrees. They are writing sensationalized stories for rating purposes and have no fundamental idea what is really going on or how to even report it. They treat the economic news the same way they’d report a train crash.
As soon as people stop listening to these blow-hards report the news, we’d all feel better about things and move on.
This whole problem really boils down to common sense and discipline. Know how much you earn and live within your means. Don’t borrow to fill in the gap and pretend that your debt will not have to be paid back. Americans have been living like there is no tommorrow. Well, tommorrow is here. Americans act like the government should have all the solutions. Forget the government and take reponsibility. I know the problem might seem complicated, but if businesses and individuals followed the rules of morality and common sense we wouldn’t be here.
We the people, in order to form a more perfect union
I don’t agree with blaming the government. Most Americans contributed to the current mess by living beyond their means, buying homes they couldn’t afford, and in turn driving up real estate prices to ridiculous levels.
The economy is in large part due to consumer psychology. From the stock market boom, to real estate boom, to now doom and gloom, it is the collective psyche of the American public which drives these cycles. Everything now is doom and gloom so even those who haven’t been affected by it are talking about it, a little scared and saving more. Previously, we were on a decade long spending spree. First, the Nasdaq boom, then the real estate boom which left everyone feeling rich. We were fat, dumb and happy! Now, reality is setting in. We realize the mistakes we made. We are reeling things in and saving a little more.
The economy is fueled by hope and optimism. The government can’t fix all the problems, but what they can and are doing is attempting to restore confidence, hope and optimism so that “we the people” can go revive this great nation.
IT IS UP TO US, NOT THE GOVERNMENT!
This admistration had a chance to actually be “different” and “change” things. Instead, not even 1 MONTH into his presidency, Obama pushes a package that is loaded with social spending that has NOTHING to do with job creation. He has 4 years to push an agenda but he couldn’t wait. Two things are clear to me:
1. No change to government is coming with this administration just the same old Democratic party BS.
2. It’s painfully apparent that Obama and is team really have no clue on how to “fix” this economy. The issue is THEY CAN’T and he will spend us into debt for generations to come. He needs to realize that and push economic recovery packages that will help the natural course of capitalism take place.
This is classic “you get what you paid for”. We all new this guy was woefully inexperienced but he was voted in anyway. It’s time to get your own house in order and start eating our “No Free” lunch.
I think certain aspects of the stimulus package will help but other parts, most of the parts, will do nothing to help. 3,000,000 jobs to be created? Balderdash. It will save jobs for those already working but I doubt many new jobs will be created and after the money runs out those saved jobs will be in jeopardy. The stimulus is only masking a problem – governments and benefits have grown too large. Of course what the stimulus will help is the people who are in trouble with their mortgage payments and everyone else will have to pay a tidy sum to help this group out while the rest of us get nothing. I think it’s good to have RE prices drop and bring them back down to earth. What is really needed is a restructuring of health care, social security and other benefits, but I doubt politicians have the guts to do what is needed. BTW, I say legalize all drugs and tax them which could be another good stream of revenue for all governments. In addition it would save lives from innocent people getting shot by gangs and in the end would make our streets safer. The fact of the matter is that the ‘War on Drugs’ is an absolute failure and a wasteful use of money. A whole new industry will be brought to life bringing with it jobs. Plus the drug money won’t finance terrorism as it currently does.
On the surface it does seem rather audacious – expending all this effort to fix a thing that is working as designed. What the pundits have thus far failed to express is that America is in capitulation; free market capitalism has proven itself to be wholly unfair to the society at-large that supports it and is therefore it is no longer worthy to be the foundation of our national economy. That’s why the Republicans are banding together so closely – that’s why they hate this so-called “stimulus” – it bodes ill for all who ascribe to the idea that a small number of people ought to be free generate great wealth while the rest of their fellow citizens are forced into a life of poverty.
HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS for the corrupt bankers of NYC, hedge fund moguls of Greenwich, and the mutual fund ‘bangers’ of Boston…. but for YOU? CHUMP CHANGE….a measly, pathetic $8-9 a week, or enough to keep SOME of us, toiling away like Gestapo ‘pets,’ for the mad dog Madoffs of NYC, the Barney Franks of Boston, and the Dodds of Greenwich. And WHERE is Obama, while Old Pelosi is running the show??? Singing like a canary in the coal mine…. for now.
The government never ever fixed economic problems, only made them worse. Recoveries came from innovation and the private sector. Besides, the US government doesn’t have any money to spend. True it can borrow a lot but it’s the private sectore that will have to pay it back. Why can’t people understand that asset prices have to fall, the stock market needs to bottom out and people have to come to an understanding that you can’t make money out of nothing. Only then there can be a recovery. The less the government does the sooner it will happen. They reinflated the bubble in 2000 and this is why things are so much worse now. You can’t escape economic reality, only postpone it but there is a price for it.
Fix the economy? The economy is not broken. It’s doing exactly what it is supposed to be doing after an out-of-control credit boom and speculative buying frenzy.
The best thing the government can do for “We the People” right now is just stay out of the way, but it’s too late for that. Their current course of action will only slow down the economic collapse, allowing enough time for Wall Street and their minions in Washington to board the life boats.
The inevitable recovery will be postponed, more jobs will be lost, more trust will vanish and more anger will rise as life will be made much more difficult for the rest of us for many years.
What has happened in the CDO market is criminal and its collapse is causing a global catastrophe that is still unfolding, but will there be justice?
Glenn Beck says Depression then Revolution. I don’t know, but either way, the fat cats need to start watching their backs…there is a hoard of crazy mad peasants in America right now and their numbers are growing.
in a word: NONE. In 3 words: NONE AT ALL. As was made clear in Atlas Shrugged, Obama and his democrats (and 3 republicans) just don’t realize who depends on whom. If every government job were eliminated, people would get work done that they were willing to pay for. but if all businesses closed down or moved elsewhere, the source of taxable income would go away for workers, and for the government. Just ask Michigan and California. Do we really want the entire country to become like them?
And one note: that $400 per worker ’stimulus’ ….. Assume the business owner that employed that worker cut the workers hours just 8 hours a month. Even at minimum wage, that would be around $60. times 12 months. = $720 / year of lost income for the worker even at minimum wage, and for the employer, who now also saves over $100 / year in FICA and FUTA taxes …. a “stimulus” for the business owner of probably $800 / year with likely little loss of revenue or production.
Want to bet the millions of business owners who are fans of Ayn Rand and Atlas Shrugged have already thought of this?
One argument can always be we need to act or we didn’t don’t do enough, or regulate enough…
The evidence clearly supports that the gov’t intervention is a major catalyst in this downturn. I have posted here for 6 months that all their action does is inject chaos into the markets which will make matters worse. The market correctly votes on the economy and the gov’t pig in a poke.
Everyone has to decide how to invest and make their own decisions. Let me suggest the “gov’t causing harm” model is by far better on your wallet than just hoping.
BTW – it’s not all one way there will be rallies during this decline.
I must respond to the comment about needing to spend more to provide more “help” to people. Here’s the CBO’s 2007 fed budget breakdown: SS-21%, Medicare/Medicaid/SCHIP- 21%, Other safety net (EITC, SSI, AFDC, etc)-9%, Interest-9%, Defense-22%, Everything Else- 19%. Isn’t over 50% enough help?
Unfortunately, We the People, are on the cool-aid. These politicians are the ones that legislated us into this financial mess. Now the new President screams for the need to urgently pass this BS “stimulus” which is really a pay-off bill to democratic supporters. The problem is the legislators. The only cure is to limit the term length of the legislators to one or two terms maximum. These legislators clearly failed history… they forgot that “taxation without representation is tyranny”. We the people will say, “NO”, sooner than later… that day is comming. The angst is palpable.
The problem is not our “form of government” it is the career legislators who have poisoned the system with their greed. Afterall, you don’t spend tens of millions of dollars to get elected to a $140,000 dollar a year job. They will never give up their strangle-hold on power without a fight. And the fight folks, will be the end for all of us; Put a fork in it.
Would’nt it be nice to hold a hearing and get to grill the Congressmen and Senators the way they grill their made for TV victims? You know, we the people, could appoint folks to hold a hearing and supena various senators and congressmen and after a mindless dumb-ass made for TV speach, we could ask some one-sided questions and then cut them off mid-sentance with another BS made for TV speach.
Clearly, the government as it stands is the problem. They know how to manipulate the news media. They learned their “mass politique” well and they play with us. It’s all about the power.
I have never been so ashamed to be a United States citizen. We have delivered the most dishonest government in the history of this wonderful country. People thought Bush was bad… well folks, you ain’t seen nothing yet. Obama is lying. Freedom is dying and the cool-aid machine keeps on pumping out the swill. Drink up America. You won’t feel a thing.
There were many warning signs, leading up to our current economic problems. Starting, with the Enron’s, the Worldcom’s, and other American corporations, who “cooked” their books with their bonfires of greed.
So, our Congress, President, SEC, and treasury, knew this was an on-going problem, but all of them failed to address the problem(s). In fact, oversight of our financial insitutions were further lessened, and these same companies (and their investors), even got huge tax breaks to boot.
After over 8 years of this, something was bound to happen. I feel it started with the oil companies and their price gouging, which drove Americans to have less retail spending. Then, you have 2 wars (one a war of convenience), which further added to our federal deficit.
After which, the housing and mortgage problems started, which showed Americans, just how much we could really trust financial insitutions, due to ARM mortgages, and derivatives, along with scam investment bankers like Madoff, and many others.
Until, there is some oversight and enforced regulation of our financial insitutions to try and prevent greed from taking over, there will be no trust factor between working America, and these “Wall Street” investors, who blame the problem on workers not spending enough to support their millionaire life style.
I wouldn’t be surprised, if military steel ammo cans became a hot item soon, in order for people to start their own savings account inside a hole sitting in their back yard.
First off, the “spendulus bill” won’t work. The amount of pork alone ($50 mil for some mouse in Pelosi’s district? NOTHING shady there! Dozens more examples exist.) renders this bill ineffective. If the money spent on pork spending instead remained in the hands of the taxpayers…oh wait, that money doesn’t even EXIST yet…so never mind.
As for Geithner, he is clueless. Listening to him the other day, it is clear that he is in so far over his head, he can’t see light to know which way is up.
As long as we try to insulate people and organizations from the consequences of their bad decisions (and that is the true liberal way), it will bring all of us down.
If the government had stayed out of it, smaller, more well-run banks with stronger balance sheets would be buying up pieces of the bigger banks that got buried by the subprime market.
Come to think of it, if the government had stayed out of it, the big banks wouldn’t have gotten into subprime in the first place. But it was forced upon them, thanks to political correctness and social engineering.
When the warning signs (in regards to Freddie and Fannie) were given by a regulator, Frank, Dodd, and Waters all attacked the regulator and insisted nothing was wrong. THESE are the people we want to help us fix this problem?
We are so screwed.
Wow, Roger Skutt’s vision of a “sucessful America” is a collectivist’s dream of utopia.
Yeah, let’s punish people who have done well and give their money to everyone else. That won’t fix anything and quite frankly it is an abuse of power and a trampling of the rights of people to keep what they earn.
All the mergers/aquisitions,outsourcing
downsizing and productivity gains which
make Business and and Investors cheer, are taking a huge toll on the American
Economy. In the last 8 years, we only gained 3 million jobs. Real (after
inflation) wages, declined because of this. Now, in one month alone, we lost almost half the jobs gained in 8 years. We cannot sustain growth this way.
Our Government decided to spend the last 8 years chasing terrorists and goosing housing prices. The Goverment threw in some stimulus, less Government regulation and tax cuts for good measure. At the same time, we let our Infrastructure deteriorate
(remember Katrina?). We could have chosen to create jobs, invest in our future and prevent huge losses, but didn’t.
Well here is a news flash.. we’re in a “severe” recession because of these decisions. Our new Government, like our old one, doesn’t seem to realize this. Bailouts are a distraction not a solution. Our Strength in the Global Economy,relies on sustaining our huge consumer market. If we continue to erode the income of consumers by less
permanent job or income creation we are sunk. Nobody will want to Invest in a declining economy.
The government will have to massively tax the *very* rich with both heavy increases in income taxes and a new tax on (great) wealth of the richest
1-5% of the population, to raise $1.5 trillion a year, in order to have the resources necessary to solve our problems, create full employment with $12/hr min wage, and get the US and the world back on the track to progress (which we were on in the 1950s-60s, with top tax rates of over 90%). By spending trillions it doesn’t have, the gov’t is risking national bankruptcy. Since Congress does not want to tax the rich, we the people will have to do it using ballot initiatives.
This guy, Paul La Monica, has been writing about business for years. What did he tell us about this disaster in the making. Did he warn anyone, like Buffet did in 2003 – when he called derivatives, “Financial Weapons of Mass Destruction.” For La Monica to write about the audacity of hopelessness, when he is part of a media that has constantly told us what we should be investing in – and has done so over the past 5 years – is a little ridiculous. Guys like him come across as know it alls and yet, when the bottom falls out, where were they, with all their financial no how and wisdom. How can it be that someone as wise as this schmuck, didn’t see the hand writing on the wall? Where were his warnings about this disastrous fall in market value. Why is he still working as a financial writer. What a joke he is.
We should realize that our current situation is a byproduct of our government’s eagerness to make the “American Dream” of owning a home possible for everyone. The same politicians that are trying to “rescue” us are the same politicians that passed legislation and force entities such as Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac to extend credit & mortgages to those who would otherwise not qualify (Subprime Mortgage Market). By doing this the government created an industry that banks, mortgage brokers, investors, and consumers could all make money. As is the capitalist society that we live in, individuals took advantage of these opportunities. Consumers got qualified for housing they couldn’t afford, the fed reduced interest rates, banks packaged loans into derivatives and securities (which now no on can value), and they government sat back and didn’t implement regulation or oversight. This is not going to get better in the near future, throwing more money at this situation will not solve our problems. Banks will still have these toxic assets on their balance sheets, credit will stay tight. The only way for this to be fixed is to allow market forces to correct the problem. Banks that were greedy and are stuck with bad assets will fail and be scooped up by more solvent banks, businesses that are over leveraged will go bankrupt, housing prices will continue to fall as foreclosures continue to hit the market and credit stays tight (which limits the supply of potential buyers). We have lived in a credit bubble for the last twenty years, finally it popped and now we are all having to pay for the mistakes of our government. Finally, realize that the real estate problems have yet to reach the commercial sector. Once they do, there are going to be even more problems for us.
The economy would heal itself if left to it’s capitalistic origins. The government stimulus will only leave the scar of mounting debt.
The real reason Obama has been talking urgency is that most of the special interest paybacks in the stimulus bill would never have made it through if Congress had taken the time to read it. Now that’s transparency! This bill had nothing to do with creating jobs.
If Geithner cannot understand the tax code (or maybe he understood and just decided it did not apply to him) is it fair to expect him to fix the economy. The private sector help? Ever hear the one about the foxes guarding the hencoop?
I think this stimulus will serve at least two purposes. One, it will hold back the destructive tide and give people a chance (and even incentivize the willingness to) act in ways that can aleviate the force of this downward spiral we are in. Two, it can open further a door in the area of health care (a door as yet only slightly tapped in the United States).
How will the first work? Temporary jobs will be created over next few years, giving people an opportunity to focus away from panicing and surviving and focus instead on maximizing the efficiency in personal resources. If this maximized efficiency combines with a willingness by financial institutions to adjust interest rates and repayment periods in consumer loans people should be able to return both to saving and spending (this time allocating a larger portion of their spending to buying American manufactured goods).
What else could help? Loan forgiveness, letting the debtor know the loan is wholly or partially forgiven, and making some life ajdustments. It is more realistic and healty for the economy than the other way. How do I know this. This is especially true for those who are in the financial condition to absorb the loss.
So it will take everyone to make this work-businesses, investors, consumers, government, and the United States as a collective. But isn’t it amazing? We have the internet and a world of information, advise, and opinions at our finger tips. Yet we are as disconnected and unorganized as we ever were, perhaps even more than ever. Information, advise, and opinions are okay. But at some point they must syntisized, taking every little speck that can be used, to create something useful, something requiring action. So who will take the initiative? Government is doing its part. And whether or not some agree with the strategy, the question now is what can I do to make it work? And what can each American do to make it work?
The government cannot even fix itself or get itself to work. The government fix the economy – good one Paul.
The Government is ultimately all of US. It is up to US to make it work. We the Poeple need to do our share and work our way out of this mess. The Government will provide the “Stimulus” using our Tax dollars and we will do the rest. We alone control our destiny. It is truly up to US.
The government can’t solve the problem completely. Society as a whole must do that. I say society, not the market. The ‘market’ is not people,it is a construct.
Confidence must come from people: the consumers who buy,and the merchants who sell.
The government can create confidence by leveling the playing field. The market can’t regulate itself because it is a construct of people, and people always act in their own self interest.
Regulation is like rules to a game. Without rules, the game is chaos.
So regulating: enforcing current rules, punishing the rulebreakers, and discouraging cheats.
That is how government will help the economy.
Peter Schiff said it best: the only thing government knows what to do to fight a fire … is to throw gasoline on it.
Unless Obama and Geithner do a 180 — and they’re not going to — we’re screwed.
Building an economy on inflation of housing was one of the stupider ideas to ever come around. Trying to reignite that is even stupider. Hello gas tank, meet Mr. Match, just how much is in here anyway?
The roots of this are in the reagan regime, when the union busting started to take hold, manufacturing dismantled and wages cut. Moving paper around or money from one pocket to another does not produce wealth, only inflated, imaginary gains. Corporate raiders buying companies to break them up and sell off the parts did untold damage, which is catching up to us. Big companies buying little ones then cutting wages and headcount plus trimming quality to the minimum takes it toll. Salesboys and salesgirls lying and pimping to increase their commissions do not produce a bit of value. We need to get back to producing and rewarding productivity for wealth rather than get rich quick, prosperity gospel, power of positive thinking nonsense.
We cannot keep paying the pound of flesh to the Shylocks of Wall Street and have our country survive.
The economy will correct itself with or without government “help”. You can’t borrow your way out of debt – any 7th grader understands that.
For those ignorant fools who don’t understand – central planners (i.e. congress, treasury etc) cannot predict the results of any economic action with any certainty especially something as large as the “stimulus” plan or the bank bailout
evidence: the last bank bailout had no effect when all the big boys said it was necessary to save the country.
My guess is that soon Obama will start to implement wage and price controls in an effort to manipulate the economy – didnt work in the 30’s – will not work now – because you can’t control things like free will, desire, weather or prices.
The economy will correct itself with or without government “help”. You can’t borrow your way out of debt – any 7th grader understands that.
My suggestion – 500 billion worth of SBA backed loans for small business = a jobs explosion.
The government can’t fix something they don’t understand. Obviously from geithners presentation he doesn’t know what he is doing, Obama doesn’t either otherwise he wouldn’t be pursuing this disastrous course.
Eliminate 50% of the federal government. Pass a Constitutional amendment for a balanced budget and reduce government spending by 50% and see how the world markets respond. My guess would be a huge return to the dollar.
The alternate option is to enact the fairtax and eliminate all income taxes. Repatriated trillions after that would bring the economy back to life immediately.
The government has failed at every project it has gotten it’s hands on.
War on drugs – FAILED
War in the middle east – FAILING
War on terror – FAILED
War on crime – FAILED
War on Poverty – FAILED
Welfare & Social Security – FAILED
Balancing Budgets – FAILED
No Child Left Behind – FAILED
Lower Taxes/Raise Taxes- Whatever they do with taxes – FAILS
Regulation – MASSIVE FAIL
TARP – FAIL
First Stimulus – FAIL
Making Home Ownership Easier – … you can answer that
So no, no hope, things will go up when the government stops fear mongering and stops trying to create a road for the markets to follow. Until we find our own bottom.
Ali
Government in the modern society should provide the basic security net. This must cornerstone of the national security. Right now we are very lopsided on military part of this. The total expenses related to the military and intelligence are reaching 1 trillion dollars. Considering current and even future military threats this is absolutely insane. At the same time the economic security of the population is very low. Government need to invest in the areas that will make the basic necessities of life (like food, basic health care and housing) be affordable even for the people in the worst economic conditions. This basic security will help overcome the fear which force people to drastically reduce their spending and will break downward spiral.
Government can never solve these problems alone, the other two segments of modern society, Business and Social will have to make adjustments also.
Business needs to decide how a financial system that soaks over 20% of GDP can be reduced to 8-10% and provide the capital that productive businesses need to operate.
People have to decide if the hero worship that they shower on men who spend big money on ice sculptures that pee champagne.
The very definition of wealth and a fair society needs to be addressed, our short term focus in finances has also clouded our thinking in the advantages of taking care of the needy and less fortunate. Until we get rid of all of the mean spirited Reaganisms concerning welfare caddy’s, the onerous and unfair drug laws and the danger of men of color there will be more suffering.
Please………give it all some time.
The stimulus packages are there JUST to stop your economy from folding completely. Things will get worse the next few months….or improve a little, nobody know this for sure….things might NEED to get worse in order to get all the rubbish and garbage out of your system.
I have full confidence that the USA will turn around once again, the EU is only starting to get hit..Just this week I heard that my job will be gone within 12 months…But I’m not giving up, we will survive this and learn from it!..One thing: No more idiotic salaries/bonusses for executives that really do nothing for a company at all…give it to the people that DO the work…..Thank you!
ntil the housing crisis has turned around the banking crisis will continue. There cannot be a recovery until banks are willing to lend again. So, in terms of lessening the decrease in GDP this stimulus will not help, but in terms of stretching out the downturn the stimulus will be effective. Reagan was pretty smart in letting the economy suffer through its necessary anti-inflation pain for 2 years and then in his third year go with the stimulus and happy talk.
In response to another comment that I read, the package has NO speical interests,,, and NO earmarks. Come on. Give up already.
Having said that, I do think tranparency is already lacking. For example, Geithner is being too vague.
Can the government do it? I’m not convinced. Too many republicans that would like to keep the easy ride of the past 8 years going, and lining pockets of the rich.
I have no faith whatsoever that that government can pull this off. There are too many special interests attached to this process and too many people who are trying to maintain the status quo in both Washington and Wall St. (in other words trying to leach as much of this stimulus money off of us, the taxpayers, as they can.)
It will not be postd, but some thoughts.
Stimulus plan will hopefully work – but this plan will mostly maintain a current status-quo. This will be good enough to bring some stability if implemented quickly. Market confidence will be back on its own but it will take time and will seep slowly.
The FSP, on the other hand, is possibly the most important item. The reason that market does not have confidence is because the proposed schemes by Geithner or Paulson are not convincing. Market believes that these teams did not do enough homework to analyse the core problem(s) — there are still too much unknowns. Paulson looked overwhelmed; Geithner does not know what he does not know.
It is funny how capitalism and free markets are blamed when the economy corrects itself. When times are good capitalism is glorified. The free market is working, just no one likes the outcome. The recession will be painfull, no doubt. Unfortunatly it is necessary so resources and labor can be redistributed to more efficient sectors of the economy. Quite honestly, the problem isn’t the recession. It was the boom that was the problem. Our phony economy must restructure.
I actually lose sleep over the real crisis that is still to come. All of the knee-jerk actions of the federal government have yet to play out. When they do we will be staring down the barrel of a hyperinflationary depression.
Just to make one thing clear.
This is not about getting rid of government. We need a Government to protect it’s people against foreign threats and to provide basic services and infrastructure to enable commerc (and legal framework to deal with criminals). I even would put a national healthcare system in that mix.
And we do need regulation. BUT only to the extent it provides a framework of rules. Anything that interferes with commerce creates imbalances in the system that results in these bubbles and blow-ups.
Right now the Government is trying to inflate the proble away and along the way is screwing every American that has a 401k and is saving for retirement. YOUR Dollar will be worth a lot less in a couple of years…
Thx to Alan Greenspan as the primary enabler of the prior bubbles. We now know where that got us.
I don’t know. I’m still divided, but I think a stimulus will do the trick, if managed right. Geither needs to take Citi or Bank of America over to show he means business. But, I also find it funny that Wall Streets opinion still matters. Everyone knows what needs to be done, they’re just afraid to do it.
To David, NY and others …
when someone says “let the economy do what it has always done,fix itself”
can u explain what the fukk that means??? It is Private sector – isn’t it??
Does ANYONE see ANY private industry (small or large) trying to invest in US – everyone is saving and scared… so where and WHEN will this end? Some one has to step up – isn’t it???
Would that be you and me – MOURON????
That IS the Whole Point (I don’t care whoever this sukker Bon Jovi is and maybe he is a Short seller)…
ALL of us need to have TRUST , CONFIDENCE AND a sense of HOPE”FUL”NESS OTHERWISE not just Obama but Bon Jovi CANNOT fix this mess – it is very similar to the example of good parenting and good schools… someone can only try to restore that confidence but if you all fukkers keep whining and complaining then NOTHING will help…
Now it IS EXTREMELY important how wisely this taxpayer money is spent by the administration and Obama MUST stick to his words & commitment because there are SO MANY of these motherfukkers ready to fix tennis and golf courts using this money!!!
You are right! These new guys haven’t been able to fix what took 30 years to ruin in the 3 plus weeks they have been in. Time to give up. Who writes this stuff?
What we need to stimulate the economy is a good war. It will bring jobs back for Halliburton, Dyncorp, Raytheon, Blackwater and a host of others. and all those street kids they can sign up for the Army which will give them discipline. It’s time to go after Iran. Israel says to, so we had better do it.
The stimulus plan will help a LOT. The free market part of the economy will probably shrink 1 to 5% this year (about $140 to $700 billion) and the stimulus plan is slightly bigger than the high end of this range. So, we should net out positive growth this year, even if it is only slight.
I would have preferred that the government had just gone out and hired about 2 million workers at $50k per year for 2 years, which would cost $200 billion, insuring that jobs actually got created: Hoover Dam like projects, etc. Putting some state aid in to stop the bleeding helps. Adding some tax cuts is like a jolt of caffeine to get the heart beating again. So, I think that adds up to about $600 to $800 billion, which is the size of what we got. Okay.
The bank bailout plan will not work. It is just propping up zombie banks to suck the blood out of us; that’s what zombies do.
We need to kill all of these bank bailout deals. There is no shortage of banks; losing a few big, bad banks will help us, not hurt us. We also need to figure out which bank has the most bad mortgage bonds (it’s either C or BAC, who bought MER) and close them first via the FDIC to send a message to the rest of the big banks to ‘bring out their dead’ now or they’ll be next. Force them to write down their bad assets to 0, sell off their good assets for cash, and get on with self-restructuring without any taxpayer money. In the mean time, the healthy banks can expand into the vacuum and grow their lending.
The combination of fiscal stimulus and closing down the bad banks will work, and we’ll be recovering by the end of this year.
You guys carping about the S-word are completely missing the point. We’re in deep enough trouble here that ideology has to take a back seat to pragmatism. If you don’t want to take my word for it, consider the unhappy opinions of a pair of conservative, free-market economists:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/12/AR2009021201602.html
You guys who are determined to prove government doesn’t work, doesn’t want to work, and is the cause of all our problems are just as emptyheaded as those who think government can solve all our problems without personal responsibility or effort. Government is a tool by which we do together that which we cannot do separately, paraphrasing the first republican president.
Borrowing from another moderately famous American statesman, “As of now, gentlemen, we must all hang together, else we shall surely hang separately.” We are, we must be, one people, one nation, one common cause, because, in this, we must not be defeated.
I left Europe for the US as I wanted to get out of a socalist environment. Sadly we are heading towards this now here in the US.
The politicians in DC started this mess with all the predatory lending law crap, everyone deserves to own a home (during the Clinton administration), forcing banks to lend money to people who shouldn’t have gotten a loan in the first place.
Senator Dodd and Senator Obama what have you done on the financial oversight comittee during all that time?
To own a house is not a god given right, it is a privilege that you earn through hard work, not spending more than you have.
The political involement forced the 2 GSE’s to lower their underwriting standards to accept all these lower quality mortgages and the wheel started spinning.
Banks always get creative to unload risk (I work in real estate lending and stayed away from all this crap as much as possible – thats why I am still employed) and when Wall Street got involved to sell this paper worldwide the death spiral started.
And now the politicians are supposed to save us? That is the ultimate JOKE!
The only blame I lay on former President Bush (besides the spending) is the fact that he had a fair warning about the GSEs and could have stopped the erosion of underwriting standards.
Let nature take its cause. We do not need politicians who are only interested in themselves to solve the problem (Senator Schumer you hear me?).
We have all the tools on the book.
Foreclosure, bankruptcy.
People who lied on their mortgage applications should get thrown out on the street. I feel no pity for these people. The are a disgrace to every hard working American who is paying his bills and mortgage and only owns a house they can afford.
Absolutely help people who get into financial trouble due to health reasons or loose their job.
SCREW EVERYONE ELSE.
My 2 cents
You can’t possibly have faith that our bailout plan will work. For starters look at the tax controversy over Mr. Geitner. How can you possibly justify selecting him. I don’t care how experienced he is. It basically says its all right to cheat and break laws because your special today.
As the one jounalist put it. Our nation has become so enamored with position and money, that we are becoming more unethical in our thoughts and actions.
This country leaders need to find their moral compass, and put it to good use.
All I have to say is that there is a serious coffee shortage in America, it is a crisis. Of which I say the government should start buying everyone coffee and supporting the coffee distributors to bring this crisis to a resolution, furthermore…
Free Market??? What???
No it won’t help, maybe in the short term, but in the long they are dooming future generations. I was always taught that you should lay in the bed you make. What happened to this mindset?
The stimulus, unfortunately, isn’t meant to fix anything! It’s simply meant to inject a bunch of money into the system over the next couple of years to prevent a complete collapse. The fixes to the economy are going to be a lot tougher because you still have a lot of true believers out there who think Ronald Reagan, and his puppet masters, were doing the right thing! They weren’t. Government is the problem? No, Government is what is suppose protect us from the sheisters like all the Bankers who just walked away with $350 Billion of our money!
The ‘Government’, which by the way is us, doesn’t have to ‘fix’ the economy. They simple need to reimplement those rules, laws, and controls established after the Great Depression and which have been systematically removed over the last 28 years. Removed using some very questionable logic that made some people VERY rich but left the rest of us worse off. The removal of regulations and controls of U.S. corporations coupled with the removal of market protections that worked from the founding of this country till Ronny removed them were 2 strikes against us. The final strike was what has caused all of the economic recessions/depressions through history, simple greed, ironically enough it was another property bubble.
There is nothing new under the sun. We’ve seen this before. We know what it takes to fix it. The problem is it won’t keep those people who got rich over the last 28 years happy.
Hi, America does not a Stimulus Package. What we need is less government spending. When people bought homes and cars ect., They knew what they where getting into so now deal with it. To sign a contract you must 18 or older so take responsibility. I know the country has slipped into a recession, but even in a good economy bad things can happen and make things tough. So lets be adults and take care of our own problems, and stop looking to the Government and other people to bail you out. As my Mom always said how you make your bed is how you sleep in it.
How does the first-time home buyer credit really help? How many people who would be first time buyers have the now necessary (and rightfully so)downpayment? If instead of an after-the fact credit a mechanism was put into place that would allow banks to credit the buyers for what they would get back count towards their downpayment alot more people would be in a position to buy their first home. Let the banks get refunded directly by the government for the amount applied once the sale is done.
After years of feast comes the famine. We go to the granaries and cisterns and they are empty. Supply side economy doesn’t work because there are not enough responsible people in the world. After basically slitting their own throats business leaders look to government to rescue them. The government makes an attempt to act responsibly and we can do nothing but criticize like a bunch of high school students.
Do I have any faith in the Gov’t to fix the economy? Let’s see, umm no. I have faith that guys like Turbotax Timmy and Limo Daschle will dodge their taxes, while raising our own. I know that BO knows nothing. I know that Dodd and Frank should be in jail. I know that Congress should take a pay cut equal to their approval rating. I know that the bailouts should not have happened. I said so before they happened, I was right. I said that FedGov would put itself in charge of recipients of MOAB funds, I was right again. Now the banks that took MOAB money, want to give it back, but apparently they can’t just give the money back. It’s all about control at this point ladies and gentlemen. Without sounding too much like a conspiracy theorist, big brother wants to control you, he is out of control. Watch out or we’ll have another 40 years of Dem rule, with 70% tax rates for top earners, 20% lending rates and double digit unemployment, with people looking for a handout from big brother.
Who is representing me in the Capitol? Since, I know for a fact that none of the guys in Washington give a darn to people/couples like us who bought a house right before the bubble (July 2007) and going crazy to pay the mortgage in time. Unfortunately, no one really cares! Part of the answer is my wife and I work so hard every single day (unlike those idiots who couldn’t afford to get a mortgage in the 1st place but got it, anyways)and trying to maintain our credit scores look good. I humbly ask you guys to get an answer for me and people I represent????
The Government may fix something, but it won’t be the economy they are fixing. Because the economy is *free* production and exchange of goods and services. “Fixing” it means taking that crucial “free” thing out of it.
It is possible to produce goods and services in non-free way, and Soviet Union demonstrated that convincingly. But it has also demonstrated the inferior quality of those goods and services and decreasing labor productivity, meaning widespread shortage of those already deficient goods.
When the people see that there is RATIONED MEDICAL CARE in the Stimulus Package that limits their ability to get health care in their older years, they will regret their vote for OBAMA.
The general consensus is that this may not help people. Why is it too late to slow down the process and not slam this through by President’s day? A moral victory for Obama and the dems getting a bad bill signed into legislation? At what cost to the average American? It seems that they are more concerned with getting this signed by Monday and have lost sight of what the true goal should be: stimulate the economy, help people keep their jobs, and stop the housing crisis. Will this bill do this? No. Mr. Obama, forget about the Monday deadline, look at the final bill for what it really is in the end: a pork spending bill that is not going to help the average American. If you do sign it on Monday, congrats. The American people will not forget it….for a very long time.
No, Congress has not noticed that a recent accounting change is the mysterious force that caused the meltdown (out of a relatively minor set of setbacks).
FAS 157 is a resurrected bean-counter rule that was less than a year old when it blew up last summer causing most of this meltdown. Resurrected: yeah, it blew up & partially caused the Great Depression & America had put a stake through its heart back then. The S.E.C. recently took the stake out. Let’s put it down again. It would be free & has a better chance to resurrect this dead puppy than the $1T mess Congress has cooked up! If a bank can make a good loan but FAS 157 would require it to go on the books with a value well below what would be loaned it will not make the loan. FAS 157 has distorted this thing beyond all recognition. The S.E.C. was less than candid in its recent report to Congress & not very insightful in looking at the data they supplied in such report that DID indicate that FAS 157 had been a major player in bank insolvencies (although they downplayed that conclusion).
See what the S.E.C. REALLY thought by searching (CONTROL-F) sections of an S.E.C. discussion http://www.sec.gov/spotlight/fairvalue/marktomarket/mtmtranscript102908.pdf for “The facts are there’s $1.2 trillion in subprime” (marked down to 30% of $1.2T; 75% performing. Do the math: even if we use 50% on the ones not performing we get 87.5%!). Search for “pro-cyclical” (FAS 157 can be expected to “feed on itself” to make bad times horrible and good times splendid). Search for “20 cents” & the discussion around page 107 is interesting / vile.
Where is the help for manufacturing? We don’t want a hand out. We just want to be able to stay in business. We are all being forced out by cheap foreign labor.
I owned a machine shop in Michigan from 1990 until 2000. We specialized in making plastic injection molds.
President Clinton told us that Nafta would create more jobs in manufacturing for both the USA and Mexico. He then granted Most favored nation to China to let them get the full benifits of the WTO.
After that manufacturing nose dived. By 2000 we could not even quote jobs. Our customers told us that a $50,000.00 job could be made in China for $15,000. This was less then our raw material prices here in the good ole USA.
Today most machine shops, Mold shop, Tool & Die shops are out of business. My shop was not a union shop. Our wages were about 35% less than union shop and still could not compete.
Equipment in our shop total investment was close to $600,000.00. Our shop rate was $50.00 /hour.
The local mechanic with $3,000.00 in tools was getting $75.00 per hour.
The difference was that our jobs could be exported and car mechanics couldn’t.
Tarriffs will truelly help to balance the playing field. Our founding fathers believed in maintaining the standard of living in this country. That is why tarriffs are in the constitution. WTO is nothing more than a transfer of wealth from our country to a communist country.
In my opinion, America is lost. We have been at war economically since 1995. Other countries played to win, We played to make the top 1% richer.
Today more people live in poverty than in 1995. Michigan, Ohio, California and many other manufacturing states are basically bankrupt. Our only solution is to work our way out of it. We cannot do this if all the jobs are in China.
For America to compete without tarrifs we would have to set minimum wage at 50 cents an hour, eliminate health care coverage, eliminate workers compensation laws, eliminate environmental laws.
Tarriffs will just allow us to compete again. Tarriffs will not cause another great depression. Free trade will. People cannot be consumers if they do not have jobs.
They housing crisis is cause by people lossing jobs. Fix this problem and the housing problem will solve itself.
I really like Cathey Brown of Parkersbury WV comments. I so vividly remember studying Keynesian economics in college. Do you think during the next round of good times we’ll start to pay down some the enormous debt we will accumulate over the next few years? Unfortunately, my bet is we probably won’t.
I have a “Jimmy Buffet for President” sticker on my car. I am sure he could have done a great job. OH WELL, too late for that. Now I just get to see my retirement account sink into a hell hole.
On the bright side, I will get to see my taxes skyrocket as I pay part of the the 100 million under the stimulus plan for devices to allow those with 30 year old TV’s to receive the new digital signals! Maybe they will be able to watch Jimmy.
This sucks.
Are you kidding me? The government should never have the responsibility of managing the economy. If the people are responsible in a democracy to manage their political institutions, then people should thus be responsible to manage their market. America is SOCIALIST. IT began with a strong federal system, and grew from there because Wilson decided to allow a central bank, income tax and on. There is one less private sector job for every public sector job. Learn real economics! We are heading toward Cuba’s misery. Wilson, Roosevelt, even Reagan were in someway socialist. Reagan liked warfare socialism, imperialism like Teddy Roosevelt. Bush, however, liked warfare and welfare. There all the same. There is never going to be CHANGE! until people suddenly realized that government, in all its forms, is the problem. The military, federal bureacracy, social security, Federal Reserve, FCC, EPA, and the list goes on. They are the cause of this mess. It is mess because no one of the American people can tell each other what their government is doing.
No, neither the stimulus bill or the bank bailout will do anything excpet fund bonuses and pay for $45mm jets. We have reached the “Peter Principle” of economics which can be said is that which recognizes that no individual, family, city, state or country can continually spend more than it earns or that can be paid back. And worse, the deficit spending is for consumption – not for assets which may appreciate or hold value. It is insanity unleashed and we will see a continual and painful decline in our standard of living as the politicians scurry in all directions like water-threatened rats, to frantically push buttons which are no longer connected to anything.
Over some extended period, IF we remain a capitalistic society – an assumption which of itself is now in serious doubt – then the American innovation and productivity MAY eventually stablilize things at a level. Don’t however expect a rebound. It’s a whole new order of things. Get used to it.
Of course not how will $15 a help fix anything that is all we will get so no it will not help i got a houes in 08 & the $8,000 tax credit for first-time home buyers will not work for me it will only help if you got one from 1/09 to 12/09
I am more concerned in possible steps that may be taken to help prevent the same type of credit abuse that occurred over the last 10 years from occurring again. Free markets only work if they are allowed to fail and then recover on their own with the individuals who made bad decisions paying a price. Unfortunately, some individuals pay the price for the mistakes of others, hence the need for some form of regulation to keep credit growth in check in the future and the current need to stabilize the financial system by propping up banks. There is a need to provide stability to the credit markets because the world economies have become so dependent on them. However, I would dearly like to see all the bad banks fail and their investors take a long ride down hill.
The major problem with the current stimulus plans is that it does not focus enough on long term investment but instead uses to may transfer payments. It’s more social engineering then anything else. The Democrats have the power. I believe they will try to legislate a more perfect economic society, but it will fail. So any rational person will prepare for the coming socialization of the country. Our current world economic problems will take a long time to work through, it’s just a matter of will the government do more harm then good by focusing on protecting the many from the few with the transfer of lots of money to attempt to equalize our society.
I think CNN should email these TalkBack responses to Obama and the Democrats. Then maybe they would get out of the business of economic manipulation. And I also think all this new crap their doing now is nothing more than welfair for individuals who couldn’t handle their own finances. Wait until they start paying off mortgages on $300,000 homes.
I was reminded and appalled with the news of how the housing market is imploding. Ft. Meyers is a shocking example, in 3 years prices have dropped 66% with 50% in the last year. All the mortgages written in the last 5-6 years are underwater. The banks and any other holders have negative assets now if they aren’t in foreclosure already.
We moved to Florida in 1993. We bought a beautiful house for $62,000 when nonprofessional wages were $8-10 per hour. That house peaked around $175,000 with nonprofessional wages still about $8-10. The bubble still has a long way to go down and it will devastate our banking and investment community.
I think the government programs are needed. First, we must fund states so they can start cutting back on layoffs and other cut backs. Second, we can to a lot of needed work like repairing infrastructure. Our bridges and electrical power grids alone will be disasters if we don’t do the work.
All money spent is not down the drain, it comes back partly as income tax, property tax and sales tax. That’s better than more bleeding from unemployment insurance and more weight on the housing market.
During World War II we spent ourselves to debt about 100% of GDP on nonproductive war materials, we survived that. We can spend this time on useful things. We can survive this.
You know it is really sad, it is all about Blame and Greed this is all of what it comes down too. It really is time to stop blaming everybody for the failures and create a solution to the problem. It is all time for those who are prospering in the name of capitalism on one hand and greed on the other to say hey I have enough. This whole buy American Crap is just what it is, this is a worldwide market. We expect other countries to buy our products don’t we? Well the bottom line is we need a solution to this problem and quickly. And to say I have lost confidence in the market would be an understatement.
So much for those voters with the “deer in the headlights” mentality that were hopelessly entralled with the “change we can believe in” ideal. Your going to get change but not the kind of change you thought it would be. Can you spell s-o-c-i-a-l-i-s-m?
Hello??? CNN??? Are you paying any attention? Look at your past Talkbacks and see if you see any pattern. Is there any significant ambiguity as to what we collectively think about the government and bailouts???
I won’t bother to answer if I think the bailout plan will help the economy. It’s near unanimous.
This happens when you elect a someone with no experience to office.
Disgrace to the Democrats who are now in charge and for the first time in a while fully control congress to really better things for the people and solve some real issues.
Instead its pork all over. I guess – quote on quote like Senator Schumer said, the people don’t care about that.
Disgusting. I consider myself a Republican and was disgusted with the prior administration’s buget management skills. But this is worse….
SHAME TO THE POLITICIANS in D.C..
We are really heading towrads desaster/complete and utter failure.
Currency devaluation waiting to happen. Sounds familiar?
Just my 2 cents.
Turn off the media and the economy will fix itself, probably quicker than the government can kick start it.
If people stop hearing how “dour” things are, and how much the latest economic measure has “plunged” or how “horrible” the latest meaningless piece of insignificantly small data is, people would probably go back about their business of conducting business and things would be normal again.
Trying to disguise a social policy spending and regulatory bill as a stimulus, is like trying to make a purse out of a sows ear. Especially when there is no time or opportunity for review and improvement. It doesn’t work. They really need to start over and truly focus on incentives for job creation. Then let free enterprise do what it does best — create opportunity!!
No much.
The stimulus may even harm.
Let’s face it — this is no NEW New Deal — it is an Old Deal, and will have the same old disastrous ramifications.
There were lessons learned from the Great Depression that were valuable. These include not letting honest savers lose their savings in bank failures. These include not raising taxes. These include not letting the money supply contract deeply and precipitously.
But those lessons most certainly did not include allowing the Federal Reserve to INCREASE the money supply by trillions.
And they did not include lessons that suggest that “government-financed” stimuli work… (Ha-Ha-Ha; it’s the people’s money, not the government’s money).
After all if you confiscate wealth from working people and from still-productive sectors and put it “to work” pounding nails, do you really think you will generate more wealth?
The money comes from somewhere, and those productive sectors wherefrom the government confiscates that money, will suffer in proportion to what is taken.
It doesn’t matter if the money is taken as taxes, or debt (which is future taxes), or in printed money (which is future inflation, a hidden, unlegislated tax on everyone) — the end result is the same:
CONFISCATION of wealth destroys wealth — it does not INCREASE wealth.
Indeed if these last 2 ‘lessons’ were really the correct lessons to have been learned from the Great Depression, Zimbabwe today would be Heaven on Earth.
The fact that it is instead Hell on Earth should teach us something.
I am not by any means an authority in economics, but my instincts suggest to me that the dithering and vacillation coming from the Obama administration regarding TARP and TARF comes to us by design. Inaction, the talking down of the economy, the demonization of Wall Street is creating a much larger crisis. A new acronym is appearing. I see it more clearly by the hour: BARF ( Betray America by Rewarding Failure ). God help us!
The Keynesian stimulus bill won’t work because we’ve already skipped part 1 of it’s two part system. Before you can utilize the government to control deflation, stimulate employment and spending and balance a plummeting economy, you have to utilize the government to balance a sky-rocketing economy. Anyone who has seriously studied Keynesian economics knows the only way government intervention works is when the government creates a “stockpile/nest-egg/safety net” during booming economic periods by upping interest rates, limiting supply, and increasing taxes to create a storehouse for bad years to come. For those ultra-left who don’t understand that, check out FDR’s Treasury Secretary and his response to how well the New “Deal” worked or look at Japan’s 8 failed stimulus attempts in the 90’s. For those ultra-right who think it’s unnecessary to be educated in economics to understand everything that’s happening, check out Joseph’s interpretation of Pharoah’s dream with seven fat cows and seven lean cows; you only make it through “lean” years if you store up during “fat” ones – in our “fat” years, Bush Jr. spent like the bills would never come due.
It’s a bipartisan problem. My solution? Vote third-party in 2010. America is growing weary of this political “chicken or fish” menu. Change is not switching to the other side of the see-saw, Mr. President. You can keep your change, your ideals, your bills, your historic legacy. All I expect from you is stay away from my right to life, liberty to live by my ideals, and the pursuit of my own happiness on my own dime.
No government which thinks putting “buy american” in an economy fixing package has any idea about how the economy works or why it is broken. One need only compare Ford Motor Companies Brazillian manufacturing operations to their American manufacturing operations to understand that isolationism and pampered unions adds momentum to economic failure.
The government is creating a bubble. There is nothing in the stimulus package to create jobs without future funding. It is temporarily buying jobs that will need to be refunded next year or in two years. Which means the depth of the recession will be slowed until the money runs out.
Spending money we don’t have will only make things worse. When the government takes our money and starts choosing economic winners we all lose. The amount of fraud and corruption ahead will be overwhelming.
Time for Americans to stop being victims.
I don’t think so; confidence is so low in banks,and policy. People are having to make decisions they don’t want to make. People are going to change to a cash lifestyle, and revolt from taxes by not keeping it in the bank. once several percent of the cash is being hoarded the banks will fail anyway, as the banks fail hoarding will become more common place. it’s going to get ugly, they are forcing Americans towards going underground. once they go underground they won’t come back, and the more that do the less funds there are to enforce causing more to go underground.
We are on the brink of a total collapse and government thinks they can fix it, they can’t they are not capable understanding.
The truth is that if anyone else did what the government is about to do to us against our will there would be stiff jail sentences. What was the last thing the government fixed? It used to fight wars well, but sadly it doesn’t even do that so well anymore. Although if Obama really wanted to balance the budget all he would have to do is get his cabinet to cough up it’s taxes.
The White House’s stimulus package is misguided. In order to revive the economy and to protect the US from revisiting the dark days of the 1930’s, the US goverment must foster growth in personal savings as well as fixing the state of our regulatory agencies. The problems before us were borne out of dissaving by households, conspicuous consumption provided by abuse of credit and a lack of regulatory oversight. Some short term corrections can be made – such as dealing with the shortcomings of the regulatory agencies – but most of the problems with the US economy will require a long term cycle for reversion to the mean. Wishful thinking if you think a stimulus bill can immediately remedy 15 years of bad habits.
Really, no one is fooled by these “recovery plans”. Very radical actions must be undertaken immediately if the US is to avoid a serious depression. The harsh reality is that most of the major banks in the US & Western Europe are insolvant. Only solution is to nationalize them, create a “good bank” comprised of whatever assets of value are left in these banks and then let the bankrupt banks fail! When sufficiently recapitalized, new bank(s) can be reprivatized under proper regulations & new management.
Absolutely not. The idea that government can control the economy is as foolish as trying to control the weather.
Not a chance. The only economists that thing this bill will work are the ones advising the president who share his ideaology on social spending. Every other economist I have read indicates this is a lot of money thrown down the toilet. It is so full of pork ($30MM for Pelosi’s mouse and $8bn for Reid’s high-speed train to Vegas) that it oinks.
Geitner is clueless on TARP II. His plan was really a plan to announce a plan. What we need for our financial system now is some confident direction and a plan that will work. We’re not getting it.
When will our Federal Government learn that the best action it can take is to get out of the way of the “Free Market” and allow the entreprenurial spirit that is encapsulated in the American Dream to get back to work?
Our Federal Government is doing nothing but creating more obstacles to prosperity.
Let us examine some facts…by asking ourselves how did we get into this mess?
1. Too much spending
2. Too much borrowing and debt
3. Too much inflating of our currency
4. Too much regulation
So to now solve our problems, we are going to watch the Federal Government spend more money, borrow more money, further inflate our currency, and increase regulation.
What is wrong with this picture? When will the “Free Markets” actually be allowed to work without interference from Federal Government?
If our number one priority is to create jobs and stimulate the economy, why are we not…
1. lowering income taxes
2. lowering corporate taxes
3. cutting/freezing all government spending except for entitlement programs such as Social Security and Medicare.
4. reducing the stranglehold of current regulations
5. eliminating the Federal Reserve’s ability to manipulate the money supply and artificially manipulate interest rates.
Why is our Federal Government so opposed to providing its citizens with incentives to save and invest money?
All of the stimilus and bank bailouts that are currently being proposed by Congress, the Obama Administration, and the previous Bush Administration included, will never solve our economic woes.
Just cracks me up that some people think the government COULD fix this. If they just did the ‘right thing’, we’d all go home happy.
Most of us know better.
No, this package is a fraud. It is not as much about spending to create jobs as it is about imposing socialism on the American people and totally destroying our Republic.
And, CNN with its leftist radical position has helped to destroy our Republic.
Unfortunately, what the sorry spectacle of the long awaited non plan of Mr Geithner showed us is they have no plan.
Mr Roubini in his op-ed in the Washington Post said it best; This was too little too late.
We need to nationalize or at least temporary take over the banks, clean them up ans sell them back to investors. Current shareholders need to be wiped out and bondholders would get whatever is left after all depositors are paid in full.
It is time to clean up and break up these too big to fail institutions. Fire all top management, they were responsible for this mess and they still don’t get it. They have destroyed the World financial system and we trust them to put it back together.
Are we nuts
I think Dave from IL is an optmist. I think this “stimulus” will destroy whatever chance for natural recovery we have
What it seems to me is that a lot of Americans and Foreign investors forgot about risk. Many forget there’s a high risk in investing in any company.
Part of this relates to the responsibility of both the consumer and owners, the stakeholders. So, the bailout, as appropriate as it may sound for those who have lost money in their poor judgment, fact is, a majority of the people should not condone the use of Taxpayer money to pay for the mistakes. What should be done is a massive revolt by the people. Protests, a lock down in government interaction, and a complete removal of the Federal Reserve, and the filing of a statute of limitations of many that have robbed the Americans of their money.
The time for revolution has come, but, we have a very serious problem. The media. It is monopolizing the mind of so many. We have now began the remedial phase of the dark ages where the human mind is exploited by something so well known as mild entertainment.
Violence is unnecessary. The law has been clear for oh, so long. The constitution tells us what we must do. We need a Constitutional Convention and the remove the power at be from corrupting the world with an empire we have never approved.
Keep us quite by spoiling us. That has been the motto. By giving us just enjoy we ask for nothing, but when given too much there’s too much at stake.
The US will fail. Sad to say, the American people have lost, and refuse to push the power button on their televisions, their computers, their cellular phones, etc.
May God be with all.
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See the government knows one thing they could push us stupid fat lazy Americans around and we don’t do anything they steal our tax dollars and give them to the wealthiest banks organizations insurance companies etc. the people of Germany France England Spain and most other countries would be flipping cars over in the streets getting their government back from these crooks. unless we stand up for our constitutional rights this will be only the beginning. in September there is going to be a bank holiday and our dollar will be replaced by the amaro . But don’t worry that won’t be headline news, the news will be about a pharmaceutical company in Bethesda MD who created the h1n5 flu to wipe out one-third of the population , then they can put martial law to use. If you don’t believe any of this, research on the Internet. Do yourself a favor wake up!!!!!!!!!